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It’s working perfectly. We wanted to be the guy with the small box that costs less. We wanted to have the most compelling or better than anyone else’s box. We wanted to have the most games. We wanted to play to our software strength, and tools and online. We wanted to get most respects, except for the online capability, we wanted to swap positions with Sony. We wanted to not be a year late, not be a big box, not be a more expensive box. How are we doing on that? Sony has always been our most direct competitor. Nintendo of course is a competitor. But look at the resolution you get with a controlled experience like that. Say to yourself, how in terms of using a game for a long period of time, what kind of accuracy and capability do you want? Look at the classic Nintendo positioning. Look at the graphics. Look at Nintendo’s execution in terms of online capability. We have this thing that nobody has ever seen before. When you say to your friend, hey let’s play online, you say then you have to buy an Xbox. That’s what 10 million people say. If you want to play online, get an Xbox. We’re not standing still. Look at what you saw today connecting up the world to the Windows PC. Do you expect Nintendo to rev up a team to create cross-device gaming and tool kits to develop those things? Not very likely. We clearly think that Nintendo did some things right. They were going to have the Cell be the video processor. But they didn’t know what they were doing. They said the Cell is the video processor. But they turned to Nvidia at the last minute, but Nvidia can’t do embedded DRAM. Go look at the bandwidth problems. Go ask the guys running … now. They took their year and burned it by not having a decent CPU strategy and then turning to Nvidia at the last minute. It’s a very unusual thing. Those processors are isolated from each other. ...It’s just like pointing at the Xbox 1. We were 20 percent better. But it didn’t matter. We were a year late, didn’t have the best games. We had this bigger box. We did have online. We didn't switch positions on that. |
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PlayStation Network has a lot of catching up to do, it's still not nearly as simple and streamlined as XBL, to the point where $50 is easily worth it. Unless they get some AMAZING multiplayer games on there, and remove the hassle, Sony will fail in that department again.
Same goes for Nintendo, once again don't expect much out of them in terms of decent online play, it probably isn't going to happen. But that's not what their systems are for, so whatever.
For all who own a Xbox 360, have you ever had yours power on automatically? No kidding, after playing some Texas Hold'em on "Live", I turned the 360 off, and about 10 to 15 minutes later, the 360 just powered up all by itself. The funny thing is I think it did the same thing awhile back ago, but I thought I accidentally hit something, and just thought..., that was weird. This time was different though, because I was no where near anything that could have possible turned it on. The only thing I can think of is I did have something downloading in the background (a new map for Call of Duty 3). Is it possible that the 360 can still download things with the power off, and when the download is complete, the 360 can then turn itself back on automatically??? Somebody, anybody, please let me know if you have experienced any "Ghost in the Machine" episodes like the one I had yesterday!!!
My borther's PC does that
dude, maybe u accidentaly hit the controllers dash button, i duno.
i have to say bill gates is a hater
i like the 360 and all but man dont hate what happen if the 360 lose to ps3 it comes back and hit u on the head lol.i be mad because i use to hate on the ps3
if bill is a hater, the ken is THE hater...
what bill said pails in comparison to the crap ken katuragi was spewing from one orifice or another before the ps3 launch...
360 will not lose to ps3 for one simple reason sony priced themselves out of the market.
haterade anyone???
Get a PC.
The Xbox Live system is using network techniques over 10 years old and still has the same problems today that were existent 10 years ago.
Until Xbox Live starts using dedicated servers and starts offering 90% lag-free online gaming, its no better then the Microsoft gaming ZOne that they had years ago.
$400 for a gaming beast + simplified, streamlined experience > $2000 for a semi-equal rig + an assload of bugs, incompatibilities, and crashes. The ease of use is worth the lag
PC gaming online has flattened any console yet.
Sure I agree that pc's are more expensive by far - but they are more fun as well. No one is developing total conversions for the 360 version of C+C3 ... you will sure as hell see them for the pc version - and they'll be free - more playabilty and hail the online.
Of course, if you're broke... stick to the consoles.
Xbox Live is a Geo Metro
PC is like a Honda Civic
Geo Metro is easy to use by anyone. Simple. gets you from point A to B easily and a generic driving experience. Not to mention CHEAP and barely customizable.
The Honda Civic will do everything the Geo Metro does but alot better. A smoother experience and better for more money. It has loads of options for customization and the ability to tune it up with upgrades can keep it going for years.
The Xbox360 is a shrimp in comparison to a PC you can build for $1000.
With companies teaming up and using the Steam software, PC gaming is still over 10 years ahead Xbox Live. Guess what, its all FREE to play online.
Then again you wont find any games that will have Mods like the PC on an XBox. While people will be stuck with HL2:Episode 2 and the games that come with it. PC users get access to dozens of mods for free.
The fact that Microsoft is so restrictive on Xbox Live is the reason why Xbox360 games will probably never have access to mods. Since this is the major selling point of UT2K7, its probably the reason why its not coming to the Xbox360.
why dont you shut up, and let 360 owners enjoy their console? what if we want to be able to play console-specific games (blue dragon, mass effect, etc) as well as a damn good selection of online games? and its not like live is even really laggy. its one thing to favor sony, but its another to try and ruin the fun for all 360 owners on this site..
How is he trying to ruin it? Nothing says that he favors sony, hes talking about a PC. And if u take posts like this and all the other posts on this site seriously then u should just go kill urself
i'm not talking about this post specifically. if you look around this site, you'll notice that he tries to put down the 360, and up the the ps3 on a daily basis. THAT, i consider to be trying to ruin the fun for others. it gets annoying after a while, seeing the same biased opinion over and over from the same person, on a forum for a console that he doesn't even like. i am sick of the excessive negativity, because it makes reading a blog much less enjoyable.
And sadly, I see Broken_Hero has become the same as Vietone.
... in this generation MS will overtake Sony in install base - Sony will fall from it's current 65% to under 50%. MS will release 'xbox 4' in 2011 & that will kill Sony for a good lenght of time ... maybe there would be a comeback - eventually, but don't hold your breath!
!
Considering the fact that the Xbox360 is doing worse then the original Xbox and the PS3 is doing better then the PS2.
Your claim is totally invalid with no common knowledge to back it up.
Microsoft will still be in 2nd place unless Nintendo can pull ahead with the Wii.
The PS3 has such a large consumer base that it still have the highest chance of getting to 100 million.
Microsoft still has problems with Xbox Live that the service had when it first started. They still use Xbox360s to host games while taking your 50/year and laughing at subscribers.
You pay 50/month for nothing that they could offer for free. All Voice Chat is done on the host.
Friends list has been something that every other company has been offering for free including microsoft with MSN, and others like xFire.
There isnt one thing on Xbox Live that generally free on a PC. So ask yourself, is it worth 50/year to have to pay for all the extra content that microsoft gets a chunk of.
So in the end, if you regularly purchase stuff from Xbox Live, your paying Microsoft more then 50/year.
You're a real sucker for hype aren't you! ;)
"Considering the fact that the Xbox360 is doing worse then the original Xbox and the PS3 is doing better then the PS2."
How is the PS3 doing better than the PS2? The PS2 didn't launch in the US and Japan at the same time, it launched in Japan in March 2000 and the US in October 2000.
Now read the following link;
http://www.psxextreme.com/ps3-news/656.html
So the PS3 launch in the Japan AND US combined did better than the PS2 in the US after launch (about 1.5m PS3 vs 1.3m PS2), but how is that a fair comparison? If we compare the US launches only it's about the same (1m PS3 vs 1.3m PS2) baring in mind that the PS2 launched about 3 weeks earlier than the PS3 and Sony were shipping 100,000 PS2s per week, you can reason that the PS2 is also about 1m in the same time period. But worldwide it's worse, since there were millions of PS2s in Japan before the US launch, hence worldwide we're talking about 1.5m PS3s compared to 5.3m PS2s!
http://uk.ps2.ign.com/articles/089/089511p1.html
As for your claim about 360 sales, they WERE doing worse than the XBox when shortages limited the numbers, but since then, things have changed! The 360 has now EXCEEDED XBox sales (but of course, YOU wouldn't notice). The following article shows that the XBox was on course for ONLY 9 million consoles worldwide in June 2003, that's 1 year and 7 months after launch. The 360 has exceeded that number in a year!
http://www.theregister.co.uk/2003/07/19/latest_xbox_figures_revealed/
this is a World-Wide System...You Have to treat it in this Way..
Sony Manufacturing and Shiping Rate of the PS3 World-wide is Bigger than the PS2 [Launch-Period Wise]....They Shipped 2 Million In Less than 2 Months
Try Commenting On the XBL service...As i see Vietone has Point in It...50$ for Nothing :)
The only reason I hate MS... they have some great products - but his arrogance and bull***** really makes me hate the company.
Oh well... guess you don't have a like a company because you like a product eh fanboys? lol
He didnt Really Switch Places....the Xbox360 Install Base is still around 4.5 Million According to the NPD...that Leaves 5 Million 360 Systems on retailers Shelves.
Anyone who Reads about the CELL processor will Understand Why is it so Incredible,the First Processor Ever that Have the Ability To work Together with another CELL processor Even if Not on the same Board..!!
That Means a Processor on China With the Right Bandwith can help Accomplish Tasks another CELL Processor in America.
Can you Even Understand How Crazy this Sound....Its Incredible.
As For the GPU...He is Over-Hyping the EDO RAM and its Effect,Microsoft Saying that it allows FSAA without a Hit in Performance is Simply False.
Gears of war Runs in the 360 Natively at 720P with No Multi-sampling...If it was truly Free,they couldve Used FSAA but they Didnt...Meaning Itns Not free.
http://www.nvnews.net/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=70056
Change the Plus to Equals
"Jacob:- Will UE3.0 support predicated tiling to make use of 4xAA on Xbox 360?
Sweeney:- Gears of War runs natively at 1280x720p without multisampling. MSAA performance doesn't scale well to next-generation deferred rendering techniques, which UE3 uses extensively for shadowing, particle systems, and fog."
So...No Free Anti-Aliasing in the 360,10MB is Simply Not Enough for 4x Anti-Aliasing at 720P.
Need I say more? Bill Gates is a moron in case any of you can't figure it out. Majority of the people I know or talked to IRL want a PS3 more than the 360. Also, if Bill was so "great" why the hell does Vista suck? You can't even run Direct X9, you have to use a emulated version of it taking up a lot of RAM that could be used for something. Plus, Vista is only for multi-threaded processors, so if you have a single processor like the Pentium 4, Microsoft Office runs slower than it did if you ran it on XP. Good job ****ing up the PC. He should focus more on what he's actually good at, coding OS'. Plus it is kind of sad that the PS3 hasn't been out that long and you can compare games to both systems and the PS3 isnt even using the Cell that much lol
4x AA is free and that is why GoW DOES USE IT. The only reason some games dont is because their engine doesnt support tileing, a technique wich uses the high bandwith of the ED RAM to do AA without bogging down the GPU. Hence, nearly free AA.
Cell is not the first to do that task eigher, my pentium 1 could do that. And the UE does allow multisampling. You obviously dont have any idea what yoiu are talking about and need to stfu.
Even if the PS3 ends up with a couple of games that have higher visual fidelity that wont get rid of 360's steller exclusive just like xbox1's might didnt get rid of ps2's. Face it, your a fanboy who is pissed because your beloved Sony *****ed up this gen. Why dont you get off it and enjoy all of the consoles like us more intelligent individuals.
ps I know my spelling is bad and I dont care
>"the Xbox360 Install Base is still around 4.5 Million According to the NPD...that Leaves 5 Million 360 Systems on retailers Shelves."
This is why I always say being a fanboy and therefore being so biased makes people stupid, whether they realize it or not.
4.5 million is the US INSTALLED BASE ONLY, not the worldwide 360 installed base.
http://www.craxtion.com/content/view/923/2/
"recent NPD Group figures put Xbox 360's US installed base at 4.5 million"
So use your brain and try to think where those other 5 million or so 360s may be.
I'll give you a clue which may shock you. Are you ready? Ok .... There are other countries besides the USA. Yeah, I know you're thinking "it can't possibly be true ABC", but trust me, it is. :P
"intelligent individuals."... if you were intelligent you wouldn't have swore dee dee dee. You're obviously the pissed off fan boy lol.
"So...No Free Anti-Aliasing in the 360,10MB is Simply Not Enough for 4x Anti-Aliasing at 720P."
Forza 2 will be 720p, 60fps, with HDR and 4xFSAA. So yet again, you're clueless on the subject.
Tim is not talking about the FSAA implementation on the 360 specifically. He is talking about full screen AA in GENERAL together with the graphics techniques they use in their game engine (and has discussed it before, if I could only find the link). Hence FSAA/MSAA would also be problematic on the PC and PS3 with their engine.
Not the article/interview I was looking for, but it says the same thing;
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Multisample_Anti-Aliasing
"Furthermore, MSAA performance does not scale well some newer rendering techniques, such as the use of multiple render targets for "deferred" rendering effects."
THAT is what Tim was talking about, but as usual, you're not interested in the real facts, you only seek to attack the 360 and praise the PS3. :|
"Anyone who Reads about the CELL processor will Understand Why is it so Incredible,the First Processor Ever that Have the Ability To work Together with another CELL processor Even if Not on the same Board..!!
That Means a Processor on China With the Right Bandwith can help Accomplish Tasks another CELL Processor in America."
I suggest you check the dates of whatever you read about Cell, because the Cell of today is NOT the Cell promised back then.
This is why Sony had to turn to NVidia for the GPU when the original plan was to use the Cell processor instead for graphics.
The Cell you speak of doesn't exist. Sorry, but that's the reality.
So what are you saying? Intelligent people do not possess the ability to use words that you deem "bad? Or are saying that every intelligent person in the whole world chooses not to use these words? Well eigher way, that type of reasoning doesnt make you look very intelligent. I dont realy know you and I may not be the most intelligent person in the world but I consider myself to be far above average, so do my peers, and the various tests I take confirm it. There is no way you can accurately judge my intelligence by my posts here alone and for you to pretend to is laughable. I can only state here my opinions and information I have gathered on the various subjects we discuss. If my info is inacurate then correct me and if you dont like my opinion then simply state your own but try not to make assumtions based on nothing.
ps I know my spelling is bad and I dont care
I,l reply to Comments in a Random Order :)
"Forza 2 will be 720p, 60fps, with HDR and 4xFSAA. So yet again, you're clueless on the subject."
My..My...ABC
True..It will be 4xFSAA at 60Fps...but that Doesnt Mean that there is No Hit in Performance [ ;) ] They are Using it,Bit that Doesnt Mean its [Free]
MS is Claiming that there is Zero Hit in Perfoemance,Actually the DRAM Decreases the Hit,Not [Negate] it Completly...you Understand Dont you :)
"Hence FSAA/MSAA would also be problematic on the PC and PS3 with their engine. "
And i Have Never Suggested Other-wise....Most PS3 games Wont Feature MSAA,and they Dont Need to...As Next-gen Games Uses Run Natively at 720P with Little Aliasing that Can Hardly be Noticed in a HDTV.
"4.5 million is the US INSTALLED BASE ONLY, not the worldwide 360 installed Base"
True...but the Doesnt Change Anything Much,the Rest of the World Includes Japan[Which the 360 is selling Miserabely and Europe]
assuming they Have Shipped 11Million By Now,there is 5 million Installed in the US,2-3 million for Europe and Rest of te World
That Still Leaves a Couple of Millions on the Shelves...
"The Cell you speak of doesn't exist. Sorry, but that's the reality. "
Hmmm....I,l Do more Reasearch When i Have time,But I am Still Positive that the Whole idea of the Cell Broadband Engine is to Turn the Entire Network into a Computer..rather than a Single Processor....and Have read it in Many Links
I wont Comment on the [Nick] Guy,since He made a Joke from Him-self and Started Apolgizing for Beign an Idiot..
He Said Gow Uses MSAA...if he Read my Post and Tim Sweeny,s Words....He wouldnt Make a fool Of Him-self..
But then....I am Used to these Types ;)
Weren't you the one at the beginning of this year caliming that analyists said the 360 sales over Christmas were disappointing? (and failed to provide proof when challenged). Hmmm. Then we got the sales and found the opposite was true, so now you desperately look for other ways to put down the figures.
>"MS is Claiming that there is Zero Hit in Perfoemance,Actually the DRAM Decreases the Hit,Not [Negate] it Completly...you Understand Dont you :)"
MS loosely use the term that it's for free. It's not 100% free, but the fact that when a game engine is designed to make use of this feature from the ground up, the hit is negligable, hence it's practically free, especially compared with traditional AA methods.
>"assuming they Have Shipped 11Million By Now,there is 5 million Installed in the US,2-3 million for Europe..."
Enough of the guesswork to make yourself feel better, let's just stick to facts please. ;)
>"Hmmm....I,l Do more Reasearch When i Have time,But I am Still Positive that the Whole idea of the Cell Broadband Engine is to Turn the Entire Network into a Computer..rather than a Single Processor....and Have read it in Many Links"
Well, during your research, look at the date of the links and articles you find. What you described was the original concept behind Cell, where developers didn't need to divide tasks themselves to run on each SPE, but instead the Cell processor was able to do this for itself, and if more power was needed, can call on other Cell processors to help out.
Hence you may read ideas about Cell processors in other household devices, like TVs and movie players, where you can plug them together and the Cell processors will communicate with each other, including over a network. Therefore some imagined your TV helping out your PS3 if more power was needed.
Cell was also suppose to be much more powerful than seen today, which is why Sony was going to use Cell instead of a dedicated GPU in their console, but then had to turn to NVidia for help. So this idea for Cell proved far too complicated to produce, resulting in a processor which whilst powerful for calculations, is still a shadow of the processor first spoken about some years ago.
Well... ;)
Actually the Sales were Disapponting,The PS2 outselled the Xbox360 this Christmas,and that is Simply What i Meant by Disappointing...It is Losing to a 6 years Old Hardware ;)
As for the Shadow of the Original CELL,I wouldnt be So Hasty In Judging,The CELL processor Is In Continuos Development,And the One in the PS3 is a Stripped Down from the Original Finished Design...The Cell BroadBand Engine Will Probably Be Realized By the Time of the Next-gen Playstation in 5 or 7 More years..
Try Praising SONY,and IBM too....the CELL is an Incredible Acheivement....Once the Concept of the Cell BroadBand Engine is Reached,It Could Lead to a Completly New Dimension.
>"Actually the Sales were Disapponting,The PS2 outselled the Xbox360 this Christmas,and that is Simply What i Meant by Disappointing...It is Losing to a 6 years Old Hardware ;)"
Liar! This is what you said;
http://ps3.qj.net/NPD-clarifies-recent-sales-reports/pg/49/aid/78169
Quote - "As i have read many analyses saying that the 360 sales were actually disappointing this Christmas.."
You made no reference to the PS2 when you made that statement, and you said this info came from analysts, not yourself. When challenged in that thread, you denied it was Christmas and said you meant analyists talking about the last 3 months of 360 sales. Now you twist it yet again by saying you meant compared to the PS2. You twist and turn and do anything other than admit what you've said. Try showing a little backbone sometimes and learn to stand by your own comments, even if it means admitting you were wrong. :|
BTW, the PS2 also outsold the PS3, and the 360 outsold the PS3, which is the real reason why you and Vietone have now taken to making a nuisance of yourselves on these boards. Seems to me you're both fustrated that the PS3 hasn't set the world on fire as you'd hoped.
>"As for the Shadow of the Original CELL,I wouldnt be So Hasty In Judging,The CELL processor Is In Continuos Development,And the One in the PS3 is a Stripped Down from the Original Finished Design..."
ALL processors are in continuos developement, Cell is not unique in this respect. As for stripped down, Cell in the PS3 is only stripped down in the sense that ONE SPE has been disabled to improve yields. Other than that, it's exactly the same processor.
Also, what do you mean by judging? I'm talking about Cell as it currently stands, I didn't say it sucks or anything like that. I say it as it is, the Cell has strengths but it also has weaknesses (like all processors). But when it comes to Cell or any other hardware in the PS3, you only seem to be interested in the strengths whilst ignoring the weaknesses.
>"Try Praising SONY,and IBM too....the CELL is an Incredible Acheivement...."
Praise for what? Cell is excellent but it's nothing revolutionary, it's evolutionary, and it's argueable whether it offers a desireable solution for future processors. Right now, I'm more in favour of symmetical multi-core processors over the asymmetric approach of Cell.
>"Once the Concept of the Cell BroadBand Engine is Reached,It Could Lead to a Completly New Dimension."
And what concept(s) will that be? There are some aspects that have been achieved, others haven't and it will probably remain that way for the foreseeable future.
There's a place for both symmetrical and asymmetrical multi-core processors in future, but in the end, don't expect a revolution from either, expect an evolution instead.
I used to have some good discussions with you BH, despite the fact that we had different points of view. However, recently I've notice you've resorted more and more to the sort of fanboy behaviour I dislike the most, including lying to 'win' an arguement at all costs.
I've always said that people behave depending on the circumstances, and it's clear that both you and Vietone now feel the need to frequent 360 threads just to stir things up, lending weight to ABC's arguement that you two are less than satisfied with the PS3 and irritated by the success of the 360 so far.
Your attitude has been one of unquestioning positivity towards the PS3 and constant negativity towards the 360, where you view anything positive about the 360 in a negative light.
It wasn't that long ago when 360 fanboys were being attacked on PS3 threads with the claim that they were only there because they had nothing good to play on their console. "Why are you here, why aren't you playing games on your 360 if it's SO good?", were the words I used to read. So BH, given that you have little (if any) interest in the 360, why are YOU here?
:D
I don't care about xbox 360. The PS3 just came out and game programmers haven't harnessed the potential of the PS3. in about a year, the xbox 360 will fail. suck that bill gates
your a troll, please go away
*
I remember when i used to hate nV Sony announced they were going with it for the vid card, and that was E3 2005, when it was announced, so, little Billy isnt doing his homework now is he?
The 360 is really going well now,the obsessive jealousy of M$ by some people on this site(over from the pS3 section of course)is unbelievable,they are so desperate they are making fools of themselves,keep up the good work M$ and make as much money as possible and keep those great 360 games coming out.
If Vietone or Broken Dragon post you can Bet your life it is because M$ have got it right, they are actually a bonus to the 360 because you know whatever they say is always negative but its obvious they really mean the reverse and they dont like it,KEEP UP THE GOOD WORK.
hi evryone. M$ said that the xenos did 48 billion sops per clock per cycle. and sony claimed RSX can do 73 billion sops.
but after a while ATI gut got interviewed and said that the XENOS CAN DO 48 per cycle, but it can do 2 cycles per clock meaning that it has 96 billion sops (not far off the G80 or R600) can anyone find this as ahard fact? or is it speculation.and one more question OD YOU THINK GEARS OF WAR has reached the graphical limitof the 360?
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